@Mary It's possible. Especially if she and Ji-ho are celebrating her birthday (since it's 29 July). 

I hope that's not the case since it'd come off as a contrived way to avoid Ji-ho and Woo-h** addressing their conflict.

@lol Mian killing Haegu has nothing to do with deserts. Considering how dysfunctional Haegu clearly is, it’s obvious she was also wronged, yes. But not by Mian. So that does not factor into the question of whether she’s culpable for the harm brought by her own actions. And I don’t even hate Haegu (since she luckily has enough dimensionality to sustain her character), even if her behaviour disgusts me. Nor do I think Mian taking revenge would be “best” or healthiest for her, because the healthiest ending would be her keeping her hands clean and getting the he** up out there away from all these people/establishing an appropriate relationship. I say it would be “interesting” because it would truly be an exercise in genius writing to make the audience want to root for a clearly repellent relationship because Haegu is sufficiently sympathetic and has a complex, traumatic background of previous victimisation. Taking the unexpected route would be some incisive commentary, especially if it’s meant to be tragic. But given the lack of thematic attention paid to it thus far, I guess the inherent taboo’s only real purpose is being jerkbait. And making people run up in my comments telling me I can’t read and don’t understand because I don’t downplay how reprehensible the relationship is so they can enjoy the pairing without guilt.

@lol All this equivocation about, “actually maybe the dreams never happened to begin with” and “if they did happen, they don’t mean attraction” is silly to me, especially since it contradicts everything we’re told all but explicitly. Even IF both of those things were true and Haegu spontaneously developed attraction to Mian the millisecond Mian turned 18/19, that is STILL objectionable. I have to assume you’re young yourself if you don’t immediately see that as the major contention. It’s creepy at best to be attracted to a teenager at that age. It is absolutely outrageous to be attracted to the teenager you raised. No one in their right mind would say “oh, ok understandable” to a stepfather/parent/whatever being sexually interested in the kid they adopted/raised because he (allegedly) only started jacking it to them when they hit their mid/late teens. It’s totally repugnant. Homegirl is just only barely better than Humbert Humbert as far as I’m concerned.

@lol 1.       If this is what you got out of my comment, you need never accuse someone of being unable to read again. Nowhere did I say that Haegu is tossing Mian into a proverbial dungeon and trying to cut her off from the outside world as part of some grand scheme. I said, out of inappropriate jealousy – which no, is not understandable – she is directly interfering with Mian deepening her friendship with Banwoo. It does not need to be conscious or pre-meditated to be distasteful.   This would be wildly inappropriate between a normal couple. It goes far beyond “inappropriate” given Mian’s limited external relationships and the fact Haegu raised her. 

And that’s really the major issue. You keep trying to deny Haegu was ever attracted to Mian as a teenager. Leaving aside that Mian would still be a teen now (even if she’s 20, that makes her 19 internationally), we are directly told that Haegu dreams of her (including sexually)…and it didn’t just start recently. When the story poses the question of when it did start – and when Mian started to see the “weakness” she could exploit – we are shown that incident from five years ago. Ockham’s razor cuts, and 2 + 2 is 4.

@lol 1.       The narrative doesn’t need to introduce a psychiatrist character to hold the audience’s hand and start listing mental illnesses to infer that erratic and contradictory behaviour (and affections) stem from traumatic and unhealthy upbringing. It is not normal (or healthy) for your parental guardian to try to groom you into murdering them. It is not normal or healthy to be grow up around contract killers and the casual attitude towards taking human life. It is not normal or healthy to grow up entertaining fantasies of murdering your parental guardian (at the behest and encouragement and facilitation of said guardian). It is not normal or healthy to make shoot your parental guardian or otherwise make attempts on their life (multiple times). It is not normal or healthy to dedicate yourself to crafting elaborate schemes with intent to emotionally “destroy” your guardian (along with yourself) as revenge. Nor is it normal or healthy to enter a sexual relationship with said parental guardian. Haegu does not need to tape Mian’s eyes open in front of her kills, or spend her down time tormenting her like a moustache-twirling villain for the situation, environment, and dynamic to be psychologically damaging. Be serious. You can either be raised to murder someone with your own hands, or you can have a normal upbringing. They are not inclusive. Saying that Mian “would never have gone to uni” without Haegu or learned to manage her trauma (based on what?) is ridiculous.

@lol 1. I would call this a semantic argument, but it’s not even that. So if the adult raised the child and then entered a sexual relationship with said child because it’s now technically legal (a la Woody Allen) this is fine to you? Haegu doesn’t stop the sexual contact (something Mian notes she could do if she wanted to, multiple times), starts initiating it within a handful of chapters, and continues developing the relationship. That is pursuing a relationship.

2.  There’s no problem with the wording. The meaning should be clear from context. Yes, her intentions are irrelevant. Because even if she took in the kid she orphaned out of benevolence and the goodness of her heart, the very action and subsequent years would still be damaging. But she didn’t do it out of the goodness of her heart. She specifically singled out the kid whose father she murdered before her eyes (again, she did not adopt any of the other children rescued), and the first thing she did was taunt the kid about his death then construct an adversarial dynamic by instilling (and enforcing over years) the idea that said kid should kill her. Ergo, she yes, intentionally, conditioned the kid into becoming her killer. Whether she believed doing such a thing was turning the kid a favour immaterial, because it’s obviously not, point blank period. And it is absolutely absurd to me to claim this miraculously had no effect on Mian emotionally, even more so by supporting the claim with the characters exhibiting the most disordered behaviours imaginable.

@lol

Beyond that, it’s normal for children to develop misplaced romantic interest in adult authority figures. It is NOT normal for said interest to trigger commensurate attraction in the adult. And despite Haegu’s verbal denials, that is what the narrative is telling us happened given the juxtaposition of Mian’s idle thoughts and Haegu’s own reflection on how long Mian’s been appearing in her dreams.

I’m frankly uninterested in placing the burden of initiation at Mian’s feet, and it’s notably a deflection that only serves to make the sexual relationship (and s** scenes) more palatable. Regardless of whether Mian “wants it” or not, it is bizarre to develop attraction to a teenager as an adult. It is more bizarre for that attraction to be to a teenager that you yourself raised, and it’s strangest of all to then act on it regardless of later technical legalit -- and I hope you’re not ready to sincerely argue with me otherwise. Whether the audience or the narrative itself wants to acknowledge it, Mian’s been deeply wronged. Hence why I said it would be interesting if Mian actually went through with killing Haegu -- though, again, the chances are nil since for all the story has to say about male systemic and sexual exploitation of women, the oddness of the main relationship so far seems to be more for titillation than anything.  

@lol 4. She’s giving Banwoo death glares primarily because she is jealous. Let’s be serious. You people getting in your feelings about my disapproval of Haegu’s behaviour seem to think my conception of her character is some long-term schemer and thus jump to pre-emptive defence against this accusation I never made, whilst ironically trying to tell me that I’m the one who can’t read. 

As I recall, the beginning of the series has the teacher make a comment that the kids are becoming of legal age that year (19). Given that Korean age is one year older than international age, that would put Mian somewhere between 18-19 years old. Ergo, five years ago, she was 13, maybe 14. Even if she was 15 years old, there is absolutely no difference between 13 and 15 in the eyes of a normal, functional adult when it comes to perceiving them as viable sexual partners (he**, it’s even hard to distinguish them because they age groups just look like children). Anyone who would disagree with that is either a creep (at best) or a child themselves. You keep bringing up Mian’s burgeoning sexual curiosity being normal, but nowhere did I ever dispute that it is. The only thing I said is that she didn’t have a snowball’s chance of normal emotional (or sexual) development when she’s surrounded by violence, her caretaker insists on facilitating her own murder, and her environment is generally psychologically unhealthy, which is a fact even you yourself agree with.

@lol 3. I don’t “make it sound” like anything. But by your own admission, Haegu has indeed raised her in a psychologically unhealthy environment. Her intentions are irrelevant. The objective reality is that Mian was kidnapped by the woman who murdered her parent in front of her, then raised in a household where she is constantly subjected to and surrounded by the aftermath of murder, and is in fact actively encouraged to immerse herself in the infliction of violence. To compound this (and I presume no psychiatric intervention whatsoever to deal with the previous), there is no way for her to repair any kind of normal attachment because she’s enmeshed in a forced deception of the outside world, whilst said murderer (and now guardian) also spends the rest of her childhood saying her job is to grow up and take revenge by killing her. There is no earthly reality where this string of events would not be traumatic and formative, even if Haegu had the most angelic intentions (which she didn’t). I assume for now that Haegu making Mian an instrument of her own self-loathing was out of guilt for inflicting the same suffering she experienced as child, but it was a selfish choice in the end, regardless of the reason. She at least could’ve not killed the man in front of her. She could have placed Mian in state care, failing that. She did not take any of the other kids she rescued, mind you. So if her top priority were actually Mian growing up into a functional, adjusted adult, then the story would never have happened.

@lol 1.       She is functionally, physically, and legally her guardian. Subjective familial sentiment is irrelevant when talking about the relationship between a dependent and benefactor. Hence (normal) people’s disgust with, say, Woody Allen. Or the general distaste towards men/adults who go on to sexually pursue children they watched grow up, whether there is a familial relationship or not.

2.       I feel like I shouldn’t have to explain turns of phrase, but it should be obvious that Haegu struggles with her attraction to Mian (although that evaporated pretty much instantly with no real exploration). Wallowing in self-loathing and negative self-talk -- instead of addressing the issue -- is a common method of dysfunctionally “dealing” with guilt (especially of the sexual variety) as it allows one to preserve the ego and self-conception by creating distance between a person and their desires. It does not have to be a conscious or intentional action.

@shan My reading comprehension is fine, but I question yours. Again, if you don't have the desire to engage with the narrative elements as presented, you are free to jack off without comment.

@lol Just goon in silence, please.

@One gyal Gaji is still having serious health issues, so they said serialisation will be irregular.

@Adri Arjo Yeah, I get you. I will say I expected more angst considering the scale and intensity of Woohui's and Ji-ho's fight. While I can't see Woohui directing hostility towards Yeon-woo in any circumstance, that argument did feel like a turning point...so I thought we'd see a bit more emotional anguish and introspection from Woohui. And that she'd be better at articulating the real reason she was upset, because she seemed to have realised her own jealousy and desire for reciprocation (at least it in part) in 39 — she even almost said it aloud. 

I guess it's possible she just doesn't want to reveal that to Yeon-woo (though her inner monologue/body language doesn't suggest she's hiding it) and Yeon-woo will end up being the one to draw it outta her since Yeon-woo likes her/finds her amusing in the same way she finds Ji-ho funny. 

But yeah, it does feel like the narrative tension was walked back a bit. Is that what you meant?

@Adri Arjo I can kinda see it...but I guess I don't really find it out of character because, for all Woo-h** says she dislikes Yeon-woo, she's never been anything but polite to her. Woo-h** is kinda like that in general...thinking about how she is with Sun-deok or even those mean girls/gossips. It's hard to keep in mind because most of her screentime is with Ji-ho, but she's really only assertive and uninhibited when they're together. Plus she's down about their fight and she knows she was in the wrong, so that could contribute.

@Adri Arjo In what way?

@Jay Also, LMFAO at him showing up at the end and batting his eyelashes at her. This mf really said "😏".